[09:05] *** Turingi joined #setiquest. [09:05] *** Turingi left irc: Changing host [09:05] *** Turingi joined #setiquest. [09:05] *** Turingi left irc: Read error: Connection reset by peer [09:05] *** Turingi joined #setiquest. [09:05] *** Turingi left irc: Changing host [09:05] *** Turingi joined #setiquest. [12:39] *** Turingi left irc: Read error: Connection reset by peer [15:44] *** Turingi joined #setiquest. [16:58] *** sigblips joined #setiquest. [17:51] Turingi: The weekly setiQuest community IRC meeting will begin in 10 minutes. [17:53] *** Jill joined #setiquest. [17:54] *** Nick change: Jill -> Guest33370 [17:54] *** Guest33370 left irc: Client Quit [17:56] *** JillT joined #setiquest. [17:57] *** jrseti_ joined #setiquest. [17:58] I emailed Lou, reminding him... [17:59] *** lnigra joined #setiquest. [17:59] Hi all. [18:00] Hi! [18:00] Hello all! [18:00] See http://setiquest.org/forum/topic/community-meeting-2012-10-09 [18:00] Title: Community Meeting 2012-10-09 | setiQuest (at setiquest.org) [18:01] lnigra: SETILive update? [18:01] Sure... [18:01] please [18:02] Hello everybody. It's nice to see so many people here today. [18:02] Ready for SETILive update or should we wait for stragglers [18:03] do you feel like the Maytag repairman? [18:03] I'm a little busier than Gordon Jump was but I'm less dead :-) [18:03] Lou, please start [18:04] Ok, we've set a target of limited use of the new site (like a beta) for a week from today... [18:05] It's basically functional with Frank now doing all the image rendering and uploading of waterfall images to AWS... [18:06] The client is now much snappier, limited only by downloading the ready made images just like it does currently with Archive data... [18:06] *** dk3232 joined #setiquest. [18:08] any chance of moving the target up by one day - my talk at Google Zeitgeist is next monday [18:08] Who is Frank? So jrseti_: your setiinfoserver4 on AWS is no longer doing the rendering? [18:08] Is this live on the site? Or, is there a BETA site? [18:08] hello [18:09] Sorry folks, Frank is the data server for SETILive - works between the telescope data and SETIlive... [18:09] Hello dk3232: You can see what you've missing so far here http://irc.sigblips.com/setiQuest/2012/setiquest.10-09-2012.log [18:09] dk3232: Hello. We are discussion the new SETILive improvements [18:09] It's not live on the site. The beta will be a separate site to be used for about a week at most before pushing it live... [18:10] Let me know when/if you'd like me to test on the BETA site [18:10] Monday might be a realistic date for you to show the beta site, but definitely not making it openly available. It will be invitation only [18:11] No worries, jrseti, We'll invite the usual suspects and a few more [18:11] good [18:12] separate beta site would be fine for monday [18:12] It sounds like jrseti_'s setiinfoserver4 is no longer rendering the waterfalls? Is that correct? [18:13] The experience will be focused on live fresh data, with time until followup deadline and when that's over, time until new fresh data arrives. They will be approximate (probably minimums) since it's not terribly predictable. [18:13] Yes, it is rendering [18:13] Sigblips: Did you spot a problem? [18:14] oh... i meant image creation. yes rendering usually refers to creating the waterfall data structures and jrseti's program still does that [18:14] No problem, just curious. So Frank is doing the "image" rendering like it was doing? [18:14] Image creation, thanks Lou, that explains my question. [18:14] No, the "Renderer" does the image rendering [18:15] images are currently created by the SETILive server (Marv) and is done in parallel by the user's browser when the user is the very first to get a waterfall... [18:16] the browser won't be doing that any more and also Marv won't be taking cpu time to do it either. [18:16] hello there [18:16] ooh, JillT hello :) [18:17] The other change that will affect jrseti's renderer is that we want to add the L and R spectra together instead of delivering them separately... [18:17] Hello, turning. See You can see what you've missing so far here http://irc.sigblips.com/setiQuest/2012/setiquest.10-09-2012.log [18:17] what if the Fermi paradox exists because information bandwidth moves more and more into cables or narrow point-to-point links [18:18] such that the actual leak-through signals may not increase much, if at all [18:18] I've started making the appropriate changes to my version of Renderer and I'll discuss that with jrseti separately... [18:19] i.e. if radio is a dead end for communication, even now we're moving into lower power devices [18:19] We will add an opt-in email notification option so people can get an email reminder of when the telescope is next scheduled to be active... [18:19] did you follow up on all the seti live signals that were marked since march? [18:19] We're adding a "copy" and "paste" function for marking signals so it's much easier and faster to classify RFI... [18:20] Turingi: That is the "L" term in the Drake equation, right? [18:20] Once the beta is working, I want to start a discussion about a public API because we're committed to doing that. We just need to know what would be useful to the community and what things we might not be able to share. [18:21] No, L & R polarizations. [18:21] Sorry, I was confused what the question was. [18:22] I was replying to Turingi's thread [18:22] compamp archives would be awesome, but zooniverse doesn't own that. We can at the very least make the rendered data available for all waterfalls that have been seen by someone... [18:22] we don't keep the ones that don't get served although we could have a discussion about keeping those... [18:22] there's a cost involved in storing them of course. [18:23] ;That's the basics. Any questions? [18:23] Lou - one of the reasons for discussing Beta at Zeitgeist is because they are bound to want to do the mobile platform with API, so we should discuss what we are prepared to share on phone this week. [18:23] The compamp archives could easily be made available if that is something people want done. [18:23] jrseti_: no, rather advanced civilizations may use communication that's hard to detect, like higher frequencies and very narrow beams and relatively low power radio [18:24] directional beams with little leak-through [18:24] the way communication is evolving on our planet now [18:24] most bandwidth is in cables rather than wirelessly [18:25] what is google Zeitgeist [18:25] also, an encrypted signal may have nothing giving it away other than unusual intensity [18:25] Turingi: That is the "L": "the length of time for which such civilizations release detectable signals into space". Cable leakage is not detectable very far. [18:25] Ok, Jill. Let's talk about opening up data and what the constraints and issues are later this week [18:26] it was described to me as 'what TED used to be' - gathering of ~400 folks who listen to talks from people like me for 3 days [18:27] BTW, the L and R thing: looking at them separately for detection doesn't make much sense. Power combine them and you get a more robust signal with less fading and generally better signal to noise. [18:27] lnigra: I'll be prepared for more testing this week. [18:28] sorry jrseti, more testing of what specifically? Followups? (oh there's another topic I should address) [18:28] Yes, followups. If you need to test [18:28] if signal is purely circularly polarized (one good guess) then addition just adds noise to correct polarization - but i think its OK to help speed up the search [18:29] yes, I have one more testing thing to do before we go live with followups. later this week would be good. We'll work something out by email. [18:29] ok [18:30] jrseti_: in this case, the L term may not mean much, consider that low power signals fade with distance and p2p beams become no easier to detect [18:30] and presumably an alien would use encryption [18:30] ahh... just remembered, ATA yields X&Y pols so R&L are already mixed, addition is fine [18:31] so then you have to look for short duration and unusually high intensity signals [18:31] "p2p" = ? [18:31] point to point [18:32] Currently we are trying to detect signals, not decode them. [18:32] oh yeah. I should have mentioned that. they are actually x and y. [18:32] still, what would an encrypted radio communication look like [18:32] from a few light years out [18:34] Jill, do you think a demonstration at the zeitgeist thing will suffice for you? [18:34] They could look a lot like what human encrypted radio signals look like. They are very detectable, just not decodable. We really have no idea what sort of modulation SETI might use though. [18:35] jrseti how is the distro coming along [18:35] linux distro for seti? [18:36] dk3232: See http://setiquest.org/forum/topic/community-meeting-2012-10-09 item 2 [18:36] Title: Community Meeting 2012-10-09 | setiQuest (at setiquest.org) [18:36] It is ready for someone to try it. [18:36] It is about 3GB and contains everything you should need to run. In your virtual machine you need to assign 4GB and at least 2 processors to the VM. [18:36] Once it boots up, the login name is "sonata". The password is "sonata" the root password is "sonata". [18:37] You should be able to run the Voyager test. The instructions are in the "Test the build - Run a Test" section at the bottom of http://setiquest.org/content/sonata-build. I have included this section below. Note: everything is built, you should only have to run the test. The entire SonATA repository is located in /home/sonata/SonATA. [18:37] How much RAM needs to be allocated for it to run the voyager demo in VMware? [18:38] 4GB [18:38] Lou - i won't be using demo slides - i planned to mention opportunity to try out new SETIlive in a moderated discussion that takes place after my talk ---- my slides are all big beautiful - gee whiz stuff - no words or numbers [18:38] Do you have 8 GB in your MacBook? I only have 4 GB so it will swap a lot but I'll give it a try. [18:39] Yes, I have 8GB [18:39] i wish I had a computer to test it [18:40] You could try it with 3GB assigned to it. [18:40] See what happens [18:41] Anything else to discuss? [18:42] I take that as a "No"? [18:42] SETI Live participation is very low. Last night I was the only person there classifying. Any plans? [18:43] I assume there will be a big push for more participants once the BETA work is implemented on the live site. [18:44] A couple months ago Follow Ups had a big push. [18:45] You don't want to over push people. [18:46] Lou is working on it. THis time everything will be working properly before we advertise for more participants. [18:48] Sigblips has a very good point - we are going to have to think hard about how to get our volunteers back - i'm very hopeful for mobile app, but we will struggle before we get there. [18:48] the distro is a souped-up seti@home? [18:49] No, seti@home is a different project by a different organization. [18:49] Turingi: No, it is the open sources SonATA software we use for real-time signal detection. [18:49] i will try to classify more [18:49] the SETI Institute does not run the seti@home program [18:50] i haven't in a while [18:50] but I will start to again [18:50] jrseti: ah, presumably you would run it off the back of a home dish? [18:50] No, only using data from the Allen Telescope Array [18:52] Shall we end the meeting? [18:53] With a bit of software development work someone could get SonATA to work with the dish in their backyard. [18:53] Sigblips: More than a bit! [18:53] Well, if I had a dish in my backyard ... [18:57] I need to sign off now. Thanks all for the chat this week! [18:57] *** jrseti_ left irc: Remote host closed the connection [18:58] I'll post the transcript in the forum. It was great having so many people here, hope to see you all next week. [19:01] *** dk3232 left irc: Quit: Page closed [19:07] *** lnigra left irc: Ping timeout: 245 seconds [19:09] *** JillT left irc: Quit: Page closed [21:37] *** sigblips left irc: Quit: sigblips [21:41] *** Turingi left irc: Read error: Connection reset by peer [00:00] --- Wed Oct 10 2012